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Dieter Perk
After looking peoples reaction to my previous suggestion i,ll be careful on this one
I know this Has ALOT of times discussed....but Atleast make Dieter AP because maybe 20- hp is 10% of my HP(Not much) but take a look at Gunrun +MP=no penalty
Shotguns and Assault Rifles Are Almost same but difference is the range they both damage massive-middle so why keep gunrun without penlites?i often find myself in trouble because its MP not AP all of my units have middle-stronge hp at my level
MG:-204 Doctor:-197 Assaulter:-177
177 is kinda handicap for me because he does not have Splash Resistence Plus he uses 30 skill nades
And another way i can prove it is Over-handicapped look at Health perk it requires 10 perks to unlock but only 20 HP and another Perk the Tenth docter perk gives 20 HP but requires 10 Perks?
I cant write english much correctly so sorry for any grammer mistakes you would find
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i have in 32lvl 268hp , i no need more .
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After looking peoples reaction to my previous suggestion i,ll be careful on this one
I know this Has ALOT of times discussed....but Atleast make Dieter AP because maybe 20- hp is 10% of my HP(Not much) but take a look at Gunrun +MP=no penalty
Shotguns and Assault Rifles Are Almost same but difference is the range they both damage massive-middle so why keep gunrun without penlites?i often find myself in trouble because its MP not AP all of my units have middle-stronge hp at my level
MG:-204 Doctor:-197 Assaulter:-177
177 is kinda handicap for me because he does not have Splash Resistence Plus he uses 30 skill nades
And another way i can prove it is Over-handicapped look at Health perk it requires 10 perks to unlock but only 20 HP and another Perk the Tenth docter perk gives 20 HP but requires 10 Perks?
I cant write english much correctly so sorry for any grammer mistakes you would find
There is a penalty required because long waepons are more often used than shotguns but i think 20 is tO high u need 3 health perks for getting it to a nrmal lv i think it should be lowered to 10 or some
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you are right ,it's penalty is too bad i think it should be reduced ,maybe to 10 hp
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You can skill what ever you want. Some other options are 10melee+bonus or use assault but push shootgunperks as 2nd weapon.
And another way i can prove it is Over-handicapped look at Health perk it requires 10 perks to unlock but only 20 HP and another Perk the Tenth docter perk gives 20 HP but requires 10 Perks?
Both need 10 perks and give you 20HP and 2 reg, the difference is one side give you opton for healing and good improvement of meds, other side give you options for much better healthperks.
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i have in 32lvl 268hp , i no need more .
I calculated mine and its 232 including +10 hp on 20..30 and 5+HP on level 5s
@knutistgut
I know i can put whatever skills i want according to me. But i had to give 5x Perks atleast to use AK47 at level 15 i could,nt wait till level 20 neither i could wait to give 5x perks shotgun then get 13 ap so i had to give him dieter so kindly make it AP... weight is one other thing cause you take 20 from us(Submachines) but its perk gives us 10 too so only 2 perks to back it up But what about HP with dieter? 3 Perks to make it up? and only MP? this kinda bad balance...
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In smg's u get an ap and it Costs less than an mp on assault
An ap: -20 weight, u need 2 perks to get it up
An mP: -20 hp u need 3 perks to get it up
ap Costs less than mp???
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In smg's u get an ap and it Costs less than an mp on assault
An ap: -20 weight, u need 2 perks to get it up
An mP: -20 hp u need 3 perks to get it up
ap Costs less than mp???
Same thing i am trying to make them understand
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Same thing i am trying to make them understand
Y i saw knut didnt get what u ment so i made it clear
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if u think -20hp is too much then use other weapon
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if you have high range weapon you dont need hp
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in aug i have 235hp 15 ap 11 realy 4 move / +3 from spanner and +1 aug .
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if u think -20hp is too much then use other weapon
Aksu,colt,ak47 are no long ranges
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Assault and submachine have a different range you need move 1 step closer to enemy.
Later with assault weapons (sig or aug) you have better range than sight so you still far away for a re-attack.
Its hard to compare these weapons and perk-trees.
Also notice with less hp you also can heal or regenerate again (if you survive) with less weight you are not able to bring more stuff at beginning or later you are overload and lose some ap per turn.
For example a doc with less hp but many medi because of high weight is better than a high hp and less medi because of low weight.
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Assault and submachine have a different range you need move 1 step closer to enemy.
Later with assault weapons (sig or aug) you have better range than sight so you still far away for a re-attack.
Its hard to compare these weapons and perk-trees.
Also notice with less hp you also can heal or regenerate again (if you survive) with less weight you are not able to bring more stuff at beginning or later you are overload and lose some ap per turn.
For example a doc with less hp but many medi because of high weight is better than a high hp and less medi because of low weight.
Maybe you are right but as level increases the most common thing to increase higher then everything is damage Dont get me wrong but then why does the dieter perk exist then? more range=less Movement.... Does this make sense to you? HP hardly increases in each level .But all units get 5+ to 10+ damage on weapons according to their build(Per level)....Ok now i can realize that SMG has low range that is why its APs are cheaper then Assault Perk Trees.but why AP? if you want to keep it balanced then you have to make atleast a slight change
1:Make MP for SMGs
2:Make AP for Assault riflers
You have to implant one of these changes
Now i get it why gunrunner has no Penalty Due it being close range and requiring movement But still there remains a unbalance in SMG Perk Tree and Assault Perk Tree
Also i see this topic going into wrong directions Posters like milkor_ak47,_REX_,GOD-IS-KILLED i respect you all with the comments but after studying the previous threads with comments like yours Berserker closed them i made this topic to get a sensible Answer and to see if i am right with Dieter being a over-penalty 😳
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maybe -20HP when is low lvl, make many changes in result of game, but when the nvl is more higher, thi AP point is much better than of the -20hp ☺
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maybe -20HP when is low lvl, make many changes in result of game, but when the nvl is more higher, thi AP point is much better than of the -20hp ☺
U are right its not balanced at low lv
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is 250 hp good at lvl 30? I am lvl 12 and only havr 180 hp woth five health perks
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Simplicity
It really does not affect the fact that you are getting a Movement Point instead of an action Point for an Assault Rifle specialist unit.
Movement Points are deducted first... so 40-skill Assault Rifles take 4 AP to shoot (AKSU, Colt and AK47), so even if you did get 13 AP you would only be able to take 3 shots if you are lucky.
Now If your issue is that you NEED that 1 more AP then you are not playing smart xD
Assault Rifles are mid-range weapons at 40skill, with a max of 9 range, and at around 7-9 ARs have good damage which makes it easy to hide after shooting because you will most likely be able to leave the enemies Line of Sight (LoS).
Submachine guns require you to move into an 8 cell range so you need to walk 1 cell into your enemies LoS. Not to mention submachine gun damage is pityfull when compared to Assault Rifles, so saying +1 AP for -20 weight is imbalanced is completely stupid.
Assault Rifle with Dieter will beat a Sub Machinegun with "More Action" Perk, every time, because Assault Rifles deal about 10-20 more damage than Sub Machineguns.
It is NOT imbalanced. The Sub needs to stay pretty close to the enemy to actually be effective, making every AP count, while the Assault Rifle usually stays outside of the enemies LoS and can easily maneuver with 12 AP (at lev 15-) around to not get destroyed.
So HP is a good way to pay, since Assault Rifles are heavier and can carry 40mm Grenade Launchers which make them even heavier.
So guess what, if AR units payed for +1 AP but lost 20 weight it would make them quite impractical since the AR can get really heavy including 40mm ammo.
Sub Machineguns are really light so they can afford to lose 20 weight, and NOT with Hit Points because they will most likely have to be close to the enemy units (usually all 3), so a Sub unit should get +1 AP as it will need every single action it can possibly get.
😁
EZ PZ... just like your sister lol jk
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Most +AP perks and ap builds only start to really work after lvl 20, sometimes after lvl 25; before that there are great disadvantages in using them, especially the dieter perk, since 20 hp is a lot below level 20 (and even until lvl 20-25); dieter is normally used by sig users to better position themselves before they shoot (much like m60/mg4 users use ap to position themselves, since their range is greater than their sight)
IMO Action ap to submachineguns users is way more important than to assault rifle users, since the more you level up, the more damaging and long range the assault rifles become, but submachinegun range stays mostly the same; Action points give submachinegun users a more varied array of builds to pursue to maximize their potencial (miner, grenader, melee/sub combo) that wouldn't be as advantageous is they only had movement ap, but with the weight penalties they have to make hard choices (-hp, -resistances, at least until lvl 35-40)
Honestly, I think that in this aspect, this game is very well balanced.
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